Getzen Eterna cornet bell swap

[arpthark]

My friend’s Getzen Eterna cornet had a very, very thin spot in the bell. You could press the inside of the bell and see your finger moving underneath the brass on the outside. It could probably have been easily punctured by a pin.

I suggested we do a bell swap and found a very nice silver Eterna bell on eBay. We also decided to strip the worn and spotty lacquer and I gave it a brushed finish.

It kind of looks like a mini-Frankentuba to me, like a Sam Gnagey horn— imagine a silver York bell and raw brass King body.

Plays great and I’m pretty pleased with the end result. I used a new-to-me eutectic solder (63% tin / 37% lead) which doesn’t have a “plastic” state. Its freezing point and melting point are the same. It worked great, but I still have some 60-40 (and 50-50) on hand if needed.

[Tubajug]

That does look great! Good work!

[bloke]

What luck to find that bell !

Blessing made a medium large bore knock off of that Getzen Eterna short model. I think it was called a model B141.

I had one here in new condition with a lacquer finish. I may still have it, because my memory isn't what it used to be and I don't remember whether I sold it. Those things are nice... both the Getzen and the Blessing.

Is your Eterna the medium large bore or the large bore?.
Getzen offered(s) both.

all of those Hot Cotton Jazz Band tracks that I have linked from time to time... The cornet player played all those tracks on a large bore Eterna short model. ... He just recently passed away. He was well into his 90s. He was a world-renowned OBGYN and was recruited from the Boston area to teach at University of Tennessee School of Medicine, which is how he ended up in Memphis and forming a band. When we toured Europe, he had it in the back of the van on top of some other stuff and opened it before taking it off the top of the pile. It fell and got all screwed up. He had the Blessing back up with him and we finished the tour with him playing that instrument. When we got back I straightened out that bell and got the body of that instrument plated for him.

How do you like that solder? What is the diameter?
How much does it cost?

[arpthark]

Not sure if it’s medium or large bore… it’s back with my friend now.

How do you like that solder? What is the diameter?
How much does it cost?

I got it at a stained glass supplier. $18.95 plus shipping for a pound of the 1/16”:

https://www.anythinginstainedglass.com/ ... older.html

I got the 1/16” diameter 63-37 and some 1/8” diameter 60-40 that is just a bit too thick. I had some thicker solder on hand that just ran out that I wanted to replace and I thought it was 1/8” but I guess it was somewhere in between 1/16” and 1/8”.

I like the eutectic stuff but it doesn’t allow you to fill gaps or build it up since it doesn’t have a plastic state. It seems to “run” where it’s supposed to go better and has a lower melting temperature.

[bloke]

I like the eutectic stuff but it doesn’ ... mperature.

Maybe I should just take a pass, as I tend to use the torch (raising/lowering the size/temp of the tip as I work) as a paintbrush.

Would you agree?

I found some solder that I like for a price that I can live with (1/16") but I have to buy 5 lb. spools...I simply reel it off to an empty 1 lb. spool.

I also found some super-cheap 1/8" solder which is ok...I use it for school repairs...and prevents me from running out of the 1/16th (which I use for "nice sh!t")...but - truth be told - I can "paint" with the 1/8 inch crazy cheap stuff OK.

[gocsick]

Ok I am going to be the jerk know-it-all professor here for a second.. because this solder discussion is about metallurgy.. and it pains me when terms are not used quite right..

60-40 solder is 40% lead by weight and 60% tin. When it it solid it is actually a mixture of 2 distinct phases or metal with different compositions... α is mostly Pb with a little dissolved Sn and β which is mostly Sn with a little bit of dissolved lead. Microscopically it looks like this






Here we have a the lead tin phase diagram. If we start in the molten state.. the big blue region labeled L at 60% Sn and follow that white line down.. we cross over into a white region labeled α+L. In this region both solid with the α composition and the molten solder exist in equilibrium. What it means is that there isn't a single melting point for this composition of solder... there is a temperature range were solid and liquid co-exist.. higher temperatures in this range we have more liquid at lower temperatures in this range we have more solid. Once we go below 183C all of the remaining liquid solidifies into a α+β mixture. This α+L is what Blake referred to as a "plastic" state... in casting this is actually called the "mushy" zone when you have solid and liquid together. Up until the solder cools below 183C it is still mostly liquid... so when you see solder solidifying it doesn't really look mushy or like a mixture of solid and liquid. But it does give you a little bit of time and temperature to play with between solid and runs like water.

Note though there is a specific composition, 61.9% Sn (different from Blake's 63% because of different impurities in commercial mixtures versus ultra-pure metals used to measure a phase diagram) where there is no temperature region where solid and liquid co-exist... and it truly has 1 single melting point. That is the eutectic point. Above 183C it is liquid below 183 it is α+β... And that change happens super fast.

70/30 is actually on the other side of the eutectic. Meaning that the β phase forms first when solidifying instead of the α. It will start to melt at the same temperature as 60/40, 183C, or the eutectic temperature but you need to get it a bit hotter before it is completely liquid. 50/50 has a higher melting point than either and a much larger temperature range where solid and liquid are in equilibrium or the solder is mushy.

Catalogs like Ferees also use the term "plastic range" and it ruffles my jimmies a bit.. It apparently originated with plumbers meaning "moldable/wipeable—you can mechanically shape it while it’s semi-solid..

[bloke]

I know nothing about any of this, but I "know" (eyes hands, and knob settings) what to do to make all sorts of random "soft solders" do what I need them to do. If I don't "know" on the front end, I "know" after a handful of seconds.

We - the ignorant - use the products about which we know nothing...other than how to use them.

...sorta like playing an instrument...

btw...
Thanks - scientists, developers, and manufacturers...but - give me something between 30/70 and 70/30 - and I can probably make it do what I need it to do...and it's even easier when I have a nice new non-F.U.B.A.R. torch.

[gocsick]

I forgot to add .. the bell looks great!