Vented Valves

[1 Ton Tommy]

So far as I know none of my three tubas has vented valves. If one did, what would I look for? From what I've read here on the forums, holes are drilled in some part of the valve but where?

What is the playing advantage? What problems does this cure? Why don't manufacturers do this when the instruments are built?

Is it worth doing to either my new Willson or my Big ol' Martin?

[MikeS]

Even though this is a trumpet video it explains the basics pretty well. My experience is that venting is very useful on slides you adjust frequently. It also seems to me to make slurs a little bit smoother. That observation, though, is well within the statistical margin for placebo effect error.

[bloke]

Even though this is a trumpet video it explains the basics pretty well. My experience is that venting is very useful on slides you adjust frequently. It also seems to me to make slurs a little bit smoother. That observation, though, is well within the statistical margin for placebo effect error.

Trumpet players don't seem too interested, but (re: TUBAS) when (after a minute or two) depressing the 4th valve again - releasing c. 30 square inches of cold compressed air (WHAM, against the chops - when attempting to slur) that ain't no placebo, bro'.

[je]

So far as I know none of my three tubas has vented valves. If one did, what would I look for?

[...]

Is it worth doing to either my new Willson or my Big ol' Martin?

The first valve of your Willson 3400S is vented (mine is, at least), but using a different method than typical. Notice the covered vent hole on the casing that allows air through when the valve is not pressed.

I don't need the vent on my 3400S, but it's super nice on my Willson 3060 (CC), which uses the same vent type. Even though I manipulate the 4th circuit slide on both tubas, I don't miss an additional vent because the higher air volume means minimal popping for the relatively small adjustments.

[Rick Denney]

The hole in the piston aligns with a port on the slide tubing, so that the slide tubing is vented through the hollow piston shell out the bottom of the piston. When the piston is pressed, that hole is up against the brass of the casing and does nothing.

It’s worth having done by someone who knows how. I would do it to a piston secured in a V block on the milling machine using a center-cutting end mill—twist drills can be grabby and self-feeding, both of which can lead to disaster.

With rotary valves, the vent is a small hole in the casing between the valve tubing ports. There is much less margin for error and it requires more skill to ensure that it doesn’t leak. My Hirsbrunner could use a vent in the first slide, but not to the point that I’ve been willing to risk it. Bloke drills these a bit off-center to keep them as far from the thinnest part of the valve web as possible when the valve is in use. Mr. Elephant uses more than one much smaller (than usual) hole. Miraphone at least used to vent the valves on 186 CC tubas, but not on Bb tubas.

Rick “drilling a hole in a cylindrical thin shell isn’t a beginner DIY activity” Denney

[Mary Ann]

You are dredging up memories of dancing drill bits from my past. Fortunately not on tubas.

[bloke]

A spring punch combined with a steady hand are your friends, here.

[1 Ton Tommy]

Thank you all for the information.

The intonation on my Willson 3400S is good enough that I can set the slides for a particular piece and forget it. I make a note in pencil at the top indicating 4th out or 1st out and if need be for a subsequent piece in the performance, I'll mark 4th in or 1st in or whatever in that sheet. There will no doubt be a piece where that 4th or 3rd valve slide needs to be moved during a piece but I haven't come across it yet. But this is only my second season on that horn.

I played the old 1918 Martin with ever looser valves for so many years I learned to lip it up or down a quarter tone or more and probably do that instinctively now. I had to quit playing the 1918 when lipping and alternate fingering no longer worked. In contrast, I find the Willson centers (slots) well enough that it's easier to set the slides. The Willson is such a joy to play by comparison to the 1918.

But as discussed earlier, the 3400S is heavy and I've pinched a nerve in my back hefting it off the floor next to me over and over in rehearsal, so I'm playing the BBb Mammoth on a stand this season. I'm playing string bass parts this time so the Mammoth works just fine. I can't even reach the 3rd and 4th slides on the Mammoth without getting out of my chair so venting is a non issue. I play it on a stand to save my back. That said, its intonation is good enough that I can tune up various notes and leave it alone till the temperature changes then the main tuning slide changes everything and I can reach that from the chair. And BTW thanks for helping me find an upright bell for it and thanks to Lee Stoffer for selling it to me.

[bloke]

I'm sure you can do as you say, but you can't stop your valve circuits from cooling if you don't use a particular one of them for a minute or two or all of them for several minutes. They're going to pull air into them (due to having cooled) and you're going to feel a pop sensation the first time you push them back down again.

[1 Ton Tommy]

I've noticed that on the Martin Mammoth. It has very tight valves and they will hold a vacuum over night. I haven't noticed it during a playing session though. I warm up playing scales and arpeggios that use all the valves. For our upcoming concert I'll have long periods of not playing so I'll be on the lookout for that phenomenon.

[bloke]

It's not like pulling a slide out 3 inches and then depressing the piston, but there's still a air bump involved with a cooled down closed off circuit on a tuba.

Martin tuba and sousaphone pistons - particularly when they're in new condition... amazing fit.