CASE WARS - Gator Andante 4/4 v. MTS 1207V

[anadmai]

I am about to have a debate on my hands and would like for all of you to chime in with your thoughts.

On Sunday, I ordered a Gator Andante 4/4 case for my Eb Bass (981 like). I know of another bandmate who has this case and really likes it. If you read the review on Sweetwater, it's his. His horn fits very nicely.

The case is due to arrive tomorrow.

Today, because I am never satisfied, I decided to look at the MTS cases and found a MTS 1207V for 85% off list price. $115.00 for a $700-800 case..BRAND NEW is not a bad deal. (this was from a legit music store).

I ordered this one as well. I was really looking at the Wessex case for their line of Eb's. Reminds me of the Besson cases from the early 90s.

Sooooooo, I have two cases for my Eb Bass on the way and I am going to have to decide on which one. If I were go go on cost, it would be a no-brainer...the MTS would win. There is over a $550 difference between the two. If I were to go from what I've already seen...the Gator wins. Yes, they're big cases...can't be any worse than the monster case I had to carry to school for my 3v Bundy Euphonium.

I will be going on tour with my band in June and need a GOOD case to allow me not to freak out when my horn is stored under the bus. I have a Gard Wheelie Bag I use for day to day operations.

But what say you all? Does any of you have experience with either case manufacturer?

[bloke]

adult use:

I doubt if it matters.

[BuddyRogersMusic]

Lots of experience with MTS as a dealer and end user. I'm a big fan of the company and their products. I've been to the factory and have seen first hand the lengths they go to ensure a top quality case is produced. Communication is second to none and parts support is superb. An MTS case will be a great choice for under the bus and probably some air travel. I say some because no one can predict what will happen to an instrument when it's out of our sight and being handled by non-musicians that don't see the valuable item hidden by a few layers of plastic and foam.

I have not seen a Gator tuba case and most of what I've seen from them has been soft side gig bags or keyboard cases, neither of which gives me an idea of how a tuba will be protected. Should have no problem under a bus and in/out for the gig unless there's too much "slop" in the case for the horn to shift. A goldilocks fit is most desirable; not too loose, not too tight,

And $115 for an MTS is a ridiculous deal. Glad you came across that when you did.

Chris

[Schlitzz]

Today, because I am never satisfied, I……..

It’s an online forum.

[tofu]

I’ve got a 1207 MTS case for one of my horns and for under the bus it is an excellent case.

But a caveat:

I assume when you say bus you mean an overland bus. I don’t know how big your group is or how loading is done. In many groups it’s everybody just throws their stuff under the bus and then they jump on the bus or somebody is designated the equipment person (who usually has no experience about proper loading) or tuba fragility and just shoves it all in or piles stuff on top of stuff just to expedite and close the cargo doors.

In either situation - you need to be large and in charge when your horn/case goes under a bus. You need to make sure all the small stuff that will fly around is far far away from your case. That nothing is piled on top of your case. Try to segregate all the large cases together. Tie stuff down. And be there when the doors get closed and for that matter when they open at destination. It’s amazing how many morons are in groups and at the very last second will show up & just heave their junk under the bus. And no matter how good your case is - a projectile at speed smashing into it will cause damage. Assuming the bus driver will adjust stuff to be correctly positioned before they close the bus cargo doors would be a bad assumption. They don’t care if your tuba gets damaged. They just want to close the doors and roll ASAP.

Repeat after me: You can’t be a nice guy when it comes to this and must stand your ground. I’ve been known to growl at people when we load the busses and I’m scary looking to begin with. When we flew down to Texas to play at TEMA a couple years back I said no way I’m putting my horn under a plane so the band got a box truck and the assistant director and spouse drove it the 1000 miles down there. The truck was supposed to be just for the large instruments - tuba, trombones, euphs, bari sax, string bass and percussion. It was amazing how many idiots showed up trying to shove flutes, clarinets etc on the truck because they didn’t want to carry their flute etc on the plane.

Once again being there to say NO! was important as a lot of people will shrug their shoulders and say “well okay...what’s the harm" or are just afraid to say "NO! GO AWAY! Don’t make me jam your (insert instrument here) up your butt!” Seriously, if one doesn’t take a hard line - stuff will happen - and it will always happen to your stuff.

[anadmai]

Repeat after me: You can’t be a nice guy when it comes to this and must stand your ground.

I am an anxiety riddled control freak. ....this means there is no way I am going to trust anyone with my horn. (Uncle Matt at Dillon's is the exception.)

I will more than likely be the one channeling her inner Lucy Van Pelt and making sure items stored under the bus are stored right.

[anadmai]

adult use:

I doubt if it matters.

Thank you for your expert advice. Glad I am paying you by the letter

I am grateful it doesn't matter to you. To me, it does matter because I'm not too familiar with different 3rd party case manufacturers. It matters enough to ask an internet full of strangers who might just have the information I am looking for.

"Adult Use" might be taking it a step too far. There might be children and Presbyterians present.

[anadmai]

And $115 for an MTS is a ridiculous deal. Glad you came across that when you did.

Thanks for your input. I'm sorry I can't pay you by the letter. The last response tapped me out. I was surprised when I saw the price. I should have it in a few days. We'll see how much of a deal it actually was.

[bloke]

adult use:

I doubt if it matters.

Thank you for your expert advice. Glad I am paying you by the letter

I am grateful it doesn't matter to you. To me, it does matter because I'm not too familiar with different 3rd party case manufacturers. It matters enough to ask an internet full of strangers who might just have the information I am looking for.

"Adult Use" might be taking it a step too far. There might be children and Presbyterians present.

I've dealt with a lot of molded cases made by different makers that are used and abused by school children, used and abused by college children, as well as those privately owned by grownups. They can be torn up in about a month or they can last for the rest of someone's life, depending on how they're treated. That goes for both of those makes and others. Based on what I told you originally and the particular type of response received, I wouldn't be able to predict how long either make would last with your personal use.

I'm pretty sure that at least once I've recalled how a local University probably spent the better part of $700 ea. on some MTS sousaphone cases, and when would bust at least one of the plastic wheels off (or both of them) jumping curbs with them and such (oem molded case wheels of all brands not being particularly robust, but which can be made to last if they aren't abused), then they started dragging them across the asphalt to the bus, which resulted in "polishing" away a six-inch equilateral triangular plastic corner off the bottoms of the cases.. and then would wonder why they were losing their necks and bits.
... To me, this is not something I would blame on any quality shortcoming on the part of MTS, but on ridiculous abuse.

In the past when I flew to the west coast a whole bunch of times and across the Atlantic some with a jazz band, I had some cases that would hold up to airline abuse (which hardly existed 40 years ago, yet seems to be customary today), but later sold those after leaving leaving the band. I now have molded plastic cases (Winter, another Winter, MTS, and an unidentified make, as well as a couple of wooden ones), which I'm sure will all last for at least the rest of my life being transported in the backs of my vehicles and perhaps occasionally loaded underneath a bus or in an equipment van (either by myself or other conscientious adults).

There actually is a feature on MTS cases which I really like, and that's the piano hinge. On my very large Winter cases, it gets to be a size-over-structure issue whereby the molded plastic flexibility starts coming into play. The hinges on the Winter brand molded cases are individual. I tried to solve the problem of the two halves of the case is not lining up automatically (whereby I have to guide them together) by installing an MTS style piano hinge, but alas it didn't help much. That said, I still like the feature on regular sized MTS cases, and it probably does stabilize the normal sized cases somewhat.

...so (talented with the ability to sort of become a human chat gbt) I've offered plenty more rhetoric, since the short answer seemed to somehow offend

[peterbas]

.

[bloke]

Plastic molded cases - regardless of how much padding and who made them - are just one small step past all of these nylon sacks with a little bit of foam rubber in their linings which most people use.

None of them are going to protect against any serious impact, yet all of them are going to protect more than any sack.

The worst flaw with any hard case is that there is almost always padding which contacts the rim of the bell. Were one designed whereas the rim of the bell touches nothing whatsoever (with a space of an inch or more between the bell rim and the bell end of the case) those would be superior to just about any plastic molded case.

A man by the first name of Charlie Krause - who sold tubas for large music stores decades ago - came up with a really superb idea of strapping in the bottom bow so that - during an impact - the structurally weak bell rim is prohibited from slamming against the bell end of the case, but going further with that very smart idea - which would have tied that idea into a nice bow - would have been to do as I pointed out above, which would have been to eliminate any padding from the interior of the bell ends of tuba cases - simply leaving the exposed plastic and a one or two inch air space between the case interior and the bell rim...

...but all of this (again) depends on who's handling the equipment.
Were there a logical reason to do so, I myself could probably render most any molded tuba case down to something that's only about four inches thick and a matter of a handful of minutes. (Allow me to use "tools" in such an endeavor, and even less time.)...so that brings us right back to my original short answer.

me?
I suspect I'm the same. When I ask a question to those with experience - possibly to some level of expertise - and they tell me that I should be asking another question, I get annoyed as well...but then I pay attention.

[anadmai]

I can assure you I won't go all Samsonite Gorilla on the case. Nope.

My JPacker Pro baritone case(not sure why the call it a pro case... but that's just IMHO). There is a strap to secure the bottom bow. I can see how this would be handy.

[bloke]

Packer makes a snazzy ("Marcus Bonna-ESQUE") line of "pro" cases (just mentioned above, but - even though they are very high-grade, are fiberglass-shelled, feature top-quality nylon coverings, and they rely on a zipper closure - ...

...I (me personally) would just rather deal with latches playing out rather than a zipper playing out.

Also, the person who started the thread has TWO (count 'em) TWO molded cases already (one which defines that the average price of the two was quite low), and they certainly wouldn't be interested in a third. (Yes, I sell the JP Pro cases.)

THE JP CASES THAT IMPRESS ME MORE are their run-of-the-mill molded cases.
They are THICK, whereby many probably would guess that they are heavy-wall fiberglass (yet not).
Over time, ALL of their hard cases will probably be this style, but - for now - SOME of the JP hard cases are still (medium-grade, ie. "decent") cloth-over-wood ZIPPER cases.
I'm pretty sure that the less expensive compensating E-flat is still supplied with the ZIPPER case.

Again...Mssr. - who started this thread - NEEDS NO ADDITIONAL CASES, obviously.

off topic carnival barking:
If ANYONE has a torn-up plastic molded case for the Yamaha YXB-621 tuba (and would like a nicer one...B-flat, C, F), there is CURRENTLY ONE IN STOCK case at the JP warehouse (oem for the JP179B front-action) that I could offer to someone. (A friend/customer asked me if one was available, lives way up in Alaska, was actually visiting during the holidays an hour away from the warehouse, was too eager to do something - not willing to wait on me to get a reply when checking on stock, and bought a "gater" from a big-box: mo' money, thinner plastic).

The JP mid-grade instruments' THICK molded plastic latch cases look like this:
They are HEAVY, but TOUGH.




bus-loading:
Those who load buses or vans probably need not be imbeciles, and no, (sadly) reaching the age of 25, 30, or 50 does not cure imbecility.
Just as me reminding that no case is going to absolutely prevent damage, when I load my molded cases in the back of my vehicle, I let the back seats down, pack them bottom bow FORWARD (bells to the REAR) and put other (less fragile, and lightweight) gear between the bell-ends of the cases and the back hatch (to prevent sliding and shifting during a possible emergency stop - as those are known to have occurred).
To summarize, buses' luggage bays do not damage tubas, but imbecility (located in-and-around buses' luggage bays) certainly could...and this is an example of why (in 2025) I would never take a tuba (at least, not one of my own) on a flight with me. ...a year or two ago...Someone was commuting with a YCB-826S. I offered forth that I considered that to be quite risky. "Nothing has ever happened"...until a few short months after that conversation occurred here...
..."but bloke, just buy a seat for your tuba"
...' too expensive, and too many stories of (in spite of people having done that) ticketed tubas not being allowed in the passenger area, and they had to be stowed anyway.

[anadmai]

I can’t believe this woman is agreeing with you on more than one occasion. Mercy.

I do not like zippers on a case. Not a fan. Too many bad things could happen. The JPacker “Pro” baritone case isn’t bad. Yes, it has a zipper but it’s preferred over the Gard bag it replaced. The Gard was a major pain getting the horn out. It fits that middle between case and gig bag.

I do have an update.

Case #1 (The Gator Andante 4/4) arrived. The more expensive one, and I was shipped the wrong size. Smooth. It’s going back and I’m requesting a full refund. They sent me the 3/4 case.

Doh.

Case #2 is up next.

[bloke]

... I probably would have kept it because of the elegant name, "Andante" (which, of course means slow ass...perhaps resembling the brain of the person at big box who recommended that case to you.)

Yeah, I'm not spending any money on any musical instrument (hard) case that zips up.

I still have my stunning array of California made fancy snooty-poot brand tuba sacks.
Our ceilings are high, so the set of them hangs overhead on a rack that I installed in the master bathroom on the far end away from all the humidity. I might have to use them again someday if I'm still physically able to play the tuba but too lame to carry them around in hard cases... but I probably should sell them. I think keeping stuff "just in case those things might be needed" is how dead people end up with their houses full of crap.

[Mary Ann]

New concept to me, that cases can be slippery. Obvious in retrospect, and does make it easier to slide them into the van. (The mfone bag resists, for which I have a piece of cardboard under it. However, no matter what, hard braking results in tuba forward.) I doubt I will ever travel with a large instrument again, but the slippery concept is a good one to have.

[bloke]

New concept to me, that cases can be slippery. Obvious in retrospect, and does make it easier to slide them into the van. (The mfone bag resists, for which I have a piece of cardboard under it. However, no matter what, hard braking results in tuba forward.) I doubt I will ever travel with a large instrument again, but the slippery concept is a good one to have.

yeah...and/but when I'm trying to squeeze a university's (60?) instruments in a small a space as possible, the "slippery" cases (when stacking, etc.) become problematic...
...ok...but NOT AS problematic as freakin' fixed-bell French horn cases (which do NOT "puzzle piece" ANYWHERE in ANY sort of concentrated instruments stack)...and slippery plastic fixed-bell French horn cases...?? "the worst of the worst" in this regard.

[michaelebie]

Case #1 (The Gator Andante 4/4) arrived. The more expensive one, and I was shipped the wrong size. Smooth. It’s going back and I’m requesting a full refund. They sent me the 3/4 case.

Doh.

Case #2 is up next.

When you say they sent the 3/4 size, do you mean the one meant for 18.5 inch bell? I also have a 3+1 Eb copy and I’m looking for a gig bag. I wasn’t sure if the gator bag had any wiggle room to allow the medium bag to work, or if I would need to go up to the large size that is for a 22” bell.

[anadmai]

It’s for a 3/4 sized instrument.

Much much smaller.